FEBRUARY 17, 2022 – Matthew “Matt” Laase, a Principal at Jackson | Main Architecture, shares his experience and thoughts about modular construction on an episode of Mainstream Modular hosted by Tyler Kern. Driven with passion for helping our communities with housing problems, Matt leads the conversation with the question, “How do we house our communities and provide that for folks?”
Matt started working at Jackson | Main Architecture in 2015. But before that, he was overseas (in Russia and the Middle East) working on mixed-use projects. After seeing their successes with housing, Matt became interested in the topic of housing development and passionate towards helping his countrymen with their communities. Upon joining Jackson | Main Architecture, he encountered modular construction or modular building which was a fairly new concept for him. His interest in providing housing helped him stick and further develop his craft towards volumetric modular construction.
There are a number of reasons for Matt’s interest in supporting places for people to live. But mainly, it all comes down to having good, livable spaces for the people in the community who want to live in their own neighborhood. These spaces need to be convenient in terms of transportation to work and affordability of the house for the people to live, especially the homeless. Comparing Matt’s experience living overseas, he was convinced that housing is always available no matter what was going on. In the US, especially in more expensive markets in the country, housing issues and difficulty in finding housing is evident.
Years ago, one of Matt’s partners saw modular construction, “as a way to really explore alternative methods for delivery and construction.” It can be said that architectural projects and construction haven’t been up to par with the world’s technological advancement. Even before Matt’s arrival at Jackson | Main Architecture, the firm saw modular construction, “as a way to do something different and bring some value.”
Back in 2019, Jackson | Main and Matt Laase were finalists and won a prize in the Ivory Innovations for his work developing modular prototypes for affordable workforce housing. Pleasantly surprised, he didn’t think about winning an award. He was focused on providing accessible and affordable housing to the workforce industry for the five-project pilot with the Housing Development Consortium. The topic of housing is very important for him, so he shared his ideas about modular prototypes with everyone and made sure that, “that was out there”.
The idea of being collaborative is a well-known concept especially with Jackson | Main Architecture, with it as the core of its work. For architectural projects to be successful, it takes everyone to do their own work and specialty including the contractors and owners. In Jackson | Main Architecture, for the greater good, they take it as a mission to collaborate with different groups and see to it. “And again, it goes back to providing the value to what’s available and possible.”
Modular construction is an unfamiliar concept to some developers. Though it may sound simple, one must be prepared to take on a different methodology, process, and approach on housing development. Here are some best practices that can be observed when learning modular construction for the first time:
- “Be wary of the headlines”
For those unfamiliar with modular, it can sometimes mean to them better efficiency, better building time, and better quality. But one shouldn’t just look at the surface and should go beyond that. Modular construction isn’t the same as traditional building, it’s way more complex than that. One is required to look at it in a different perspective and different methodology than what one is used to. - “Decisions have to be made much earlier in the process”
Going modular means preparation in the early stages of housing development. Before the project is started, the materials and items to be used must be decided a lot further out ahead of time. Adjustments later on or while the project is underway are highly discouraged as it can impact the whole process of modular construction. - “Financing is a different process than you would for traditional”
The process of financing a modular construction project is vastly different in comparison with traditional building construction. With modular, “a lot of that financing has to be paid up front.” There are preorders, materials, and the payment for the factory that will prepare those materials ahead of commencement of production. Lastly, before construction of the modular starts, developers have to be aware and to pay something like 50% of the project’s cost. So, that should be accounted for. - Modular construction is a superior product than the traditional build
There are things that can be tricky with modular construction but if one is committed and understanding of the things they have to overcome, then, “You are bringing something that can be finished earlier than a traditional build and can have higher quality.”
The timeline or schedule of a modular construction project is a critical aspect for its success. There are milestones that need to be achieved along the way which everyone including the contractor and owner must be aware of. With a clear schedule and plan, things can come together easier than starting down a path and falling into a habit of responding and reacting after.
The jurisdiction is the “magic wand” for the whole modular construction project. As such, most jurisdictions have no experience towards modular or general offsite construction issues. The idea that while the offsite construction is going on, other activities as well are happening at the same time. This setup is uncommon to them that’s why permitting is bifurcated. The state jurisdiction is for approving the offsite work, while the local jurisdiction is responsible for the whole project. Miscommunication and misunderstanding from the jurisdictions’ part can be seen as prevalent in several projects. Inspectors might not know what they’re looking for when they’re onsite or the plan reviewers are confused in understanding the importance of the stages of the process.
During the design process of modular construction, it is an important aspect for everyone to be collaborative with each other and to be aware of what’s being designed. The process of putting the design together requires the attention of everyone, even the factory, general contractor, engineers, and the owner. “And at various points, you have to bring that together on the modular portions and then merge it with the site build areas”, Matt said. “So if you’re working on a project, say it’s a four story above a podium, you’ve got to merge those things together, you’ve got to have them aligned. Oftentimes too, in a modular project, you’re building the facade and the cladding, at the site portion and your elevator overruns or your stair overruns and the parapets and those sorts of things. So you can’t really work in a vacuum when you’re doing modular, you’ve got to bring it all together.”
With a number of successful projects in the past, Matt says, “a successful project is one that’s finished.” Some of his completed projects are the Cubix North Park and the Cubix Othello projects. But for him, the satisfying thing about a modular project is when the set day comes. “When you’re working in a modular project, you’ve put all this time and effort into bringing them together and all the parties together. And then, it really accumulates with seeing a 50,000 pound object flying in the air dangling from a crane,” he says. He also believes that a satisfied client is what every project comes down to.
Jackson | Main Architecture has available resources for developers. These resources help such individuals to learn more about the modular process. One can find useful videos on the JMA website and such. In the words of Matt, “We’re also putting out there a lot of different white papers and just short anecdotes of information for folks.” Matt for one, is keen on reaching out to the people in the modular construction industry especially those who are confused and unsure as to what to do. “I think if there’s more work going on in the modular realm, there’s more opportunities for that housing to get built.” The industry has a lot of people – manufacturers, industry organizations, and suppliers in it willing to help. “Modular is a methodology that can get us to where we need to go. It’s a way to deliver projects of high quality at a faster timeline. And I don’t see it going away, and I only see really high horizons in the future.”
In the past year or so, there have been supply chain challenges happening in the general construction industry. It can also be said that these problems also affect the modular side. Sourcing materials in the general or traditional construction industry in the past year has been proven challenging which made modular construction more visible, but it has always been an appealing option. Modular projects are suitable for urban areas where labor and the construction cost is heavy. “That’s where modular really finds its footing from a pricing standpoint, from a cost standpoint for a developer.” For developers, they have to decide with the cost implications, whether to go with the traditional method or with modular. Building projects using traditional methods could be cheaper, but with modular, it’s quicker. For some owners in some regions, modular is clearly a more expensive option, but to be able to lease their project six or nine months earlier is a huge incentive. Basically, the owner can open their project earlier and earn income sooner. That’s what makes modular construction more appealing than the traditional general construction.
Matt strongly believes that modular construction can solve some of the community’s problems in an effective way. Ever since he was a child, he had dreamt of (and now succeeded in) becoming a successful architect. He loves innovation and how things can be different and can evolve to be better. Modular construction can prove challenging but he believes at some point, it’ll be considered more of an option. “But as far as modular goes, if you’ve got the right opportunity, you’ve got the right piece of property, you have a handle on what you’re trying to provide in what you want to build, it’s definitely an option we recommend to our clients as many times as we can.”
Mainstream Modular Spotify Podcast 
Mainstream Modular Apple Podcast
An Architect’s Open Source Conversations on Modular
Transcript:
Tyler: Welcome to Mainstream Modular, a podcast from Guerdon. I’m your host, Tyler Kern. Thanks so much for joining us for this episode of the podcast. We’re thrilled to have you along here today. Today’s episode is titled, An Architect’s Open Source Conversations on Modular. We’re going to be diving in a little bit deeper on modular with an architect here today. We are pleased to welcome to the program, Matt Laase, he’s a Principal at Jackson | Main Architecture. Matt, welcome to the podcast. Thanks for joining us.
Matt: Thanks, Tyler. Happy to be here.
Tyler: Excellent stuff. Yeah, we’re pumped to have you on, Matt. This is really great. And we were talking before we went live on the podcast about soccer and lots of other things. We’ll spare everyone else the details, but Matt and I have a lot in common when it comes to some of our interests away from modular construction. But Matt, let’s kick things off today just by talking a little bit more about Jackson | Main Architecture and your role there. So, just give us some background and some details on you.
Matt: Yeah, so I’m a Principal at Jackson | Main Architecture. I’ve been with the company since 2015. My career in the past also was with some other larger firms that included a lot of mixed-use work around the world, actually. So worked and lived in Russia for 3 and 1/2 years, spent a lot of time in the Middle East working on those same sort of mixed-use projects. Got interested in housing many years ago and very much had a passion towards, how do we house our communities and provide that for folks because it really is a problem. And got into modular through that Jackson | Main as we’ve been doing it at Jackson | Main for about 15 years. So when I joined, it was something new. And hey, there is another way. You can say it’s a better way, as easily as we can say another way. But, it really got my intrigue and pulled me in. And even to this day, I’m still learning and advancing that opportunity with volumetric modular.
Tyler: What was it specifically about housing that maybe piqued your interest just in terms of finding places for people to live and things like that? Kind of dive a little bit deeper into that, because that’s really interesting to me.
Matt: Yeah, I think it’s a combination of having lived overseas. We were expats in a foreign country and seeing how housing was always – no matter what was going on, housing was always available. And then returning back to the US and noticing the housing issues and there’s the difficulty of finding housing. I work in Seattle, one of the more expensive markets in the country and I see that problem almost on a daily basis of the homeless. But really, it falls on those that just don’t have the means to live in their own neighborhood and live in their own community. They have to commute sometimes 20, 30 minutes, maybe even up to an hour. And just because they need a place that’s affordable to live. And so, many of the communities that I’m involved in are tens of thousands. And even with Seattle, specific, hundreds of thousands of housing units behind in providing the kind of housing that they really need to support the community. So, it’s just something that I think about every time when we do a project is, how can we make sure that these are good, livable spaces because people need places to live.
Tyler: Absolutely, I think that’s really well put, and I really like how you explained that. And so, you know Matt, one of the things that we wanted to talk about here is that Jackson | Main Architects is obviously has been a champion of modular construction for a while now. What is it about modular construction specifically that’s so appealing from your perspective and from the perspective of Jackson | Main?
Matt: So we got involved in it through Guerdon back in about 15 years ago doing some work camps up in Canada, and one of our other partners just saw that as a way to really explore alternative methods for delivery and construction. We’ve been doing construction the same way for the last 100 years. And it would seem that with all the innovations we have in the world, if you think about things that have been invented in the last 100 years, we could say automobiles, we can say computers, phones, we’ve gone to the moon. All those sorts of things yet, we still build architectural projects the exact same way. So really, Jackson | Main, even before I was with the firm, saw modular as a way to do something different and bring some value. That’s really something that we look for as well is, how can we provide value to our clients.
Tyler: And affordable housing is obviously something that means a lot to you personally, as you talked about earlier, but also to Jackson | Main as well. In fact, in 2019, you were an Ivory Innovations finalist for your work developing modular prototypes for affordable workforce housing. Talk us a little bit about that and how that is a value that’s really kind of intrinsic to the firm.
Matt: Yeah, the Ivory Innovations Prize was something we were pleasantly surprised with because it wasn’t like we were out searching for, “Hey, let’s go win an award.” And the finalists in that group, and if you look back, there are some real innovators in the industry. And so, what we were really pursuing at that time was, the Housing Development Consortium was looking at a pilot five project which was trying to put housing together for that very reason of providing it for the workforce. And what we really wanted to pursue at that was, how can we make that accessible to the industry. And whether you’re a contractor, an architect, an owner, an engineer, looking at that open source methodology of which share what we’re doing. As architects, we tend to keep things to ourselves and work with our clients and talk about intellectual property and those sorts of things. But we just felt that the importance of housing is so important that we wanted to make sure that was out there. So, the Ivory Prize was really a bit of a surprise and really pleased to be able to be a part of it and just honored to be included in that same group.
Tyler: I really appreciate the collaboratory nature that you take towards modular construction because like you mentioned, architecture isn’t always that way. But this is something that you all value because this is something that leans towards the greater good, right?
Matt: Oh, absolutely. It takes everyone to do that. We can’t do what we do without the engineers and the contractors and the owners. And the investment dollars that go into it, too. So, being collaborative is something Jackson | Main really has at the core of its work. We collaborate with a lot of different groups and see that. And again, it goes back to providing the value to what’s available and possible.
Tyler: So to that end, let’s talk about some best practices when it comes to modular construction. You know, for developers who decide to try modular for the first time, they’re waiting into some things that maybe they’re not quite aware of. So, what are some things that you think that developers should be aware of when they are trying modular for the first time?
Matt: The first thing I’d say is, be wary of the headlines. Everybody wants to say, “Oh, look at modular. It’s more efficient, you can build faster, it’s higher quality.” But, you really have to look at it from a standpoint of it’s not just those things, but it’s more complex. It’s not the same as traditional building. You have to kind of remove yourself from that methodology and look at it from a different perspective in design. And then when I say design, I mean, the whole process. Decisions have to be made much earlier in the process. You can’t have the project under construction and decide, “I want to change out all the sinks to something else.” Or, you know, “I don’t like those refrigerators, let’s get a different one”, because all those decisions are made early in the process. The other thing for a developer to remember is that financing for that work is a different process than you would for traditional. Usually, construction brings on a process where you get your construction loan or your bridge loan or whatever it is. And then the contractor starts the work and they submit a payoff and then we review it and they approve it. And it just sort of cycles up and up and up and up, and it goes along the way. Well with modular, a lot of that financing has to be paid up front. There’s preorders, there’s all the materials, the factory needs to have all those prepped and ready to go. So, a lot of times developers don’t really know that process and they still think towards the traditional way. And they’re not prepared for paying 50% of the cost of your project before it’s under construction. That’s really not a mindset that they’re used to. So, that has to be accounted. But really, what I would say for developers, what it can do is if you’re committed and you’re understanding of the things that you have to overcome, you really are bringing a superior product. You are bringing something that can be finished earlier than a traditional build and can have higher quality.
Tyler: That’s really interesting. And so, have you found that setting maybe some expectations and some schedules up front, like you mentioned, planning a lot of things a lot further out ahead of time, that can make for a smoother process when it comes time for construction to actually happen. Adhering to that timeline and moving things up earlier is beneficial down the road?
Matt: It is, and the schedule is very critical. And it’s not just a matter of the design schedule, it includes the contractor, includes the owner, and all those things. And when we put a schedule together, we typically include those in there so they’re aware of what has to happen. They’re aware of the milestones that need to be met along the way because basically, what we’re trying to get to is a clarity of schedule. And how that comes together is really critical because you can start down the path and then fall into a habit of just responding and reacting when you really need to have that plan in advance.
Tyler: I think that’s well put. And when it comes to that planning phase, is it also important to then coordinate with the jurisdiction, you know, the powers that be in that particular area to make sure that you have all of your ducks in a row and everything in order the way that it needs to be done?
Matt: Oh yeah, the jurisdiction is the magic wand of the whole process. Most jurisdictions have no experience in modular or even just general offsite construction issues. So they don’t really understand the idea that the process is such that you have the offsite construction going on while there’s other activities going on. So, permitting is bifurcated. There’s the state jurisdiction, which is approving the offsite work and the local jurisdiction, which is then responsible for the whole project. But really, their scope of authority is within the stuff that’s built onsite. So there’s often miscommunication on their part, not understanding and how that comes together. And we’ve seen it several times on projects where the inspectors don’t know what they’re looking for when they come out onsite or the plan reviewers are somewhat lost in understanding that phase permit is almost a necessity in the whole process
Tyler: Yeah, I think that’s an important thing for people to be aware of and something to consider. Absolutely. And then let’s talk a little bit about the design process as well and maybe how that can be collaboratory and the importance of working together and making sure all parties are on the same page. Is that an important aspect of the design process?
Matt: Very much so. One thing you’ll find when you’re doing a modular project, you know, nobody likes meetings, there’s always, “OK, I have another meeting.” Well, we try to make those to be collaborative sessions. They’re not really meetings, they’re work sessions and they’re focused because you’re working through the process of putting the design together. And at various points, you have to bring that together on the modular portions and then merge it with the site build areas. So if you’re working on a project, say it’s a four-story above a podium, you’ve got to merge those things together, you’ve got to have them aligned. Oftentimes too, in a modular project, you’re building the facade and the cladding, at the site portion and your elevator overruns or your stair overruns and the parapets and those sorts of things. So you can’t really work in a vacuum when you’re doing modular, you’ve got to bring it all together. And that includes the factory, that’s the general contractor, that’s all the engineers, and the owner. Everyone has to work together. There’s no way to just do it in a vacuum.
Tyler: Absolutely, that’s a great point. So Matt, can you share, maybe some examples of successful projects that you’ve been able to be a part of and see come to fruition and maybe talk about what was successful. What helped make that project successful in your mind and some of the keys to that?
Matt: Well, I think it’s important to talk about a successful project is one that’s finished. I think that’s really what it comes down to and every project has its challenges. So, we’ve got three projects that we’ve completed. One is our Cubix North Park and Cubix Othello projects. And then there’s an additional one, which I unfortunately can’t mention right now because of other reasons. But, I think everyone will understand. I think what happens really, the successful part of it is or maybe we say, I think the part that helps me feel really satisfied with the work as it finishes is watching the set. When you’re working in a modular project, you’ve put all this time and effort into bringing them together and all the parties together. And then, it really accumulates with seeing a 50,000 pound object flying in the air dangling from a crane. There’s nothing like having a set day. So you know, you can say, I think every project that we’ve done is when it comes down to a successful, maybe I’m always looking at the glass is half full mentality and the shinier side of the coin. But I believe that the aspects of that project and the way they come together, a satisfied client really is what it comes down to.
Tyler: That’s a good way of putting it. And I think the idea of a successful project is a completed project is something I should probably take to heart when it comes to my own list of things that I’d like to get done in my life just in general. But, we’ll move away from that. So, tell me a little bit more about any resources that Jackson | Main has available for developers to help with the modular process. Do you have anything that people can use as resources to learn more about this?
Matt: Actually, we do, and that goes kind of towards our open source is in our website. We published a couple of videos showing the process and how the projects that we’ve completed have come together. We’re also putting out there a lot of different white papers and just short anecdotes of information for folks. The other thing is that we often get contacted by other architects saying, “Hey, I’ve got a project. I’m working on a client. I don’t really know what I’m doing,” which is OK. It’s OK to say you don’t know what you’re doing at times, “Can you give us a hand?” And I’m all for, again, helping out the rest of the industry because I think if there’s more work going on in the modular realm, there’s more opportunities for that housing to get built. There’s more opportunities for the solution to show itself in our communities. So, we often will take in owners that will just say, “Hey, I’m interested in modular. I don’t know what I’ll do.” We’ll spend an hour with them and kinda walk them through it and this is what you need to know. Architects will call and say, “I’ve got to.” You know, I talked to one just a few weeks ago about a project in New York, and I said, “Look, these are the things you need to be aware of. And if you have trouble, there’s resources out there. The industry has lots of really good partners – manufacturers, industry organizations, suppliers, they’re out there. You could just got to reach out to them. And they’re all happy to help because modular is a methodology that can get us to where we need to go. It’s a way to deliver projects of high quality at a faster timeline. And I don’t see it going away, and I only see really high horizons in the future.”
Tyler: Just for my own curiosity, how has maybe some of the supply chain challenges of the last year and a half or so, has that had an impact? Has people maybe been looking towards modular in a different way as a result of maybe just some of the challenges in sourcing materials and that sort of thing for traditional projects? Has modular become a more appealing option as a result?
Matt: I think it’s become more visible. I think it always has been an appealing option. The supply chain challenges that are happening in the general construction industry are happening for the modular side, too. I mean, you still have to get wood, you still have to buy toilets, you still have to buy sinks, you still have to get countertops, and drywall and all those sorts of things. So those can still be challenges because the price of those items can really hamper what your belief is. Well, modular, I believe, has a appropriate price point. It can be difficult in areas where the labor is a lot less expensive. So you’re looking at more urban environments, you’re looking at larger cities where that labor is costly and is a heavier burden on the construction cost. That’s where modular really finds its footing from a pricing standpoint, from a cost standpoint for a developer. So, a lot of times, developers say, “Hey, I’m curious. It’s the new shiny object. How can I go ahead and move forward with this?” And we’ll say, “Well, what you really need to do is look at what is the cost implications. Because you may be able to still build your projects cheaper using the traditional methods, but you won’t build them quicker.” And what we oftentimes go to an owner who says, “Well, modular is 20% more expensive or 10% more expensive. I’m not sure what to do there.” So well, “You’re going to be able to open your project and lease up your project six months or nine months earlier. How much is that worth to you?”
Tyler: It’s a great point.
Matt: And then they oftentimes start to open up their eyes and go, “Oh wait, you’re right. So maybe I have to pay a little more to get something better or sooner. And it pays itself off in the time that I was going to take to get my project ready, I can actually have it open and operating and having income sooner.” And that usually is the trigger point for them to say, “OK, what do I need to do? Where do I need to go and who do I need to talk to?”
Tyler: Really well put. I like that a lot. Matt, as we wrap up our conversation today, any final thoughts? Anything you want to leave people with as it relates to architecture and to modular construction? The floor is yours just for any final thoughts, anything you want to leave our listeners with.
Matt: Oh, that’s a great one. I really enjoy what I do. Obviously, I wanted to be an architect a long time ago when I was a small child even. And so, after 28 years of doing that, I just continue to love what I do. And I love the idea of innovating and I think there are so many opportunities out there to do things differently and do things better. And you know, quite honestly, modular has got my attention because I really feel strongly that this is a way we can solve some of our community’s problems in a really effective method. It’s not easy. There’s lots of challenges. There are things that you just don’t want to believe are the way it needs to be. And I’m sure at some point we’ll continue to make it more of an option. But as far as modular goes, if you’ve got the right opportunity, you’ve got the right piece of property, you have a handle on what you’re trying to provide in what you want to build, it’s definitely an option we recommend to our clients as many times as we can.
Tyler: Excellent stuff. Matt, where can people learn more about Jackson | Main Architecture as well?
Matt: So you can find us at www.jacksonmain.com . We also have Instagram and Facebook, but you can reach out to us through those methods and through those channels.
Tyler: Excellent, excellent stuff. Make sure to reach out and learn more about Jackson | Main Architecture, as well as going to Guerdon’s website: www.guerdonmodularbuildings.com.
Our guest today, Matt Laase. Matt, thank you so much for joining us here on the podcast and discussing all things modular with us. We appreciate it very much.
Matt: Yeah, thank you, Tyler, and thank you for the opportunity. Really appreciate it.
Tyler: Excellent stuff. Everyone, thank you for tuning in to another episode of Mainstream Modular. We appreciate you joining us for another episode of the show. Stay tuned and stay up to date with the latest episodes by subscribing on Apple Podcasts or Spotify, or, of course, by going to Guerdon’s website to learn more. And like I said, stay up to date because we are gonna be back soon with new episodes of the show. Thanks to my guest today, Matt Laase. I’ve been your host, Tyler Kern. Thanks for joining us.
About Guerdon
Guerdon is the leading manufacturer of large-scale, commercial modular construction projects in the Western US and Canada. Guerdon’s modern, innovative modular technology combines on-site construction with precise off-site factory assembly line production. Traditional schedules are shortened substantially because modular units are constructed in our factory-controlled environment while site work and foundation construction are completed concurrently. Guerdon helps developers, architects and general contractors gain greater control over project quality, schedule, and the bottom line. Guerdon’s factory and corporate office are in Boise, Idaho serving 12 western states including California, Colorado, Idaho, Montana, Nevada, North Dakota, South Dakota, Oregon, Utah, Washington, Arizona and Wyoming as well as Canada.
